MBTI: Stannis Baratheon- ISTJ

stan1

Spoilers! You’ve been warned!

Didn’t we just do an ISTJ like, last week maybe? Doesn’t matter, Stannis is marching through. If you don’t like it, too bad.

This is the way he lives and practically all we know of Stannis. If this guy wants something, stone-cold logic dictates that he bulldoze through anyone that would oppose him and take it. I try to leave spoilers out of the introduction so let’s get to it!

Surprisingly, even to myself, Stannis is one of my favorite characters on the show, though as of episode 9/ season 5, the writers are doing everything they can to challenge that and they may just win out. If you didn’t hate him before, it would be pretty easy to now. He’s cold and unforgiving aside from all his living sacrifices and the fact that a witch acts as his adviser. And we’re not talking about some Harry Potter’s school of witchcraft and all that, but the kind that sucks the soul out of you.

Makin' smoke babies

Makin’ smoke babies

Then again, if Stannis is ISTJ, he’s probably always been about as cold as he is now and based on how his brothers have spoken of him, this is the case. Stannis is detached and driven, sticking to what he knows, as we just previously discussed, like lead Si users. Being that they view the sensory as subjective, why wouldn’t you stick to a certain routine? Every time we see Stannis he’s either preparing to march on, or he’s…well…marching on.

And while a lot of ISTJs will differ from their parents way of thinking, they’re still prone to sticking to a specific set of rules for themselves, often originating from an outside source, rather than inner principles, as their auxiliary Te is known to play a part in. Strong Te users will also take a black and white approach to most things, preferring to have it all cut and dried.

“The Iron Throne is my right. All those that deny that are my foes.”

While “The Dance of Dragons” episode might  change some people’s minds about Stannis, nobody has been able to call him indecisive. A horrible human being, sure, but not indecisive. It’s not really a matter of what he wants, but how to get it. It’s only right that Stannis should be the next king since its his brother previously had control and is now gone, so why not him? One of the great things about the show (Haven’t read the books) is that even if you disagree or downright hate the characters, you can still see where they’re coming from.

So even though Stannis clearly should not rule, we can see why he’s going for the position all the same.

Plus he would get out of his cool but super depressing home.

Plus it would be mean getting out of his cool but super depressing home.

And it doesn’t seem to be for glory or absolute power that he’s in this for either, but what he sees as just “what is.” ISTJs don’t seek fame and fortune for the most part, but they’ll often covet some form of control over others who just can’t seem to get it right. But while their extroverted brothers, the ESTJ, don’t mind enforcing their ideas in verbose fashion, ISTJs usually exercise their ideas and beliefs through clenched teeth in a way that can make anyone feel a little uneasy. It’s as if they don’t want to tell you what they’re saying, but they’ll push through to at least try and get things done the way they want it done.

Such is the way with Stannis. While he doesn’t appear awkward (He’s born into power, he ain’t got time for that), his tone of voice is always low and steady. He doesn’t wane in his speech and he doesn’t mince words.

“I am king. Wants do not enter into it.”

It’s this that gives a bit more insight into how Stannis sees himself; carrying the burden of leadership, even though it’s not what he wants. Or at least, he doesn’t believe he wants it and sees himself as having the torch passed to him all the same.

Many would have Stannis Baratheon (Coolest name in the series, by the way) typed as INTJ. I’m not seeing it. Though the two act similarly enough, INTJ Stannis probably wouldn’t be manipulated the same way Stannis is. While he may recognize some of Melisandre’s tricks and he does question it from time to time, Dance of Dragons proved he’s not willing to go too far away from the rules he’s placed himself under. He’s not shown to be the most forward thinker, but acting based on what he knows and what he’s being told. While I don’t think an INTJ Stannis would necessarily fare better, he definitely wouldn’t be attempting to bulldoze his way through to get what he wants, as his character has been doing.

Man, I wish this guy hadn’t taken a turn for the worst. He’s been as bad as he should be anyway, but it’s like I’m not allowed to like him now.

Take your daughter to work day

Take your daughter to work day

Also note that while ISFJ Jorah is basically giving his life away for another, ISTJ Stannis is giving away everything he has for what he views as his duty. Not a black and white split down the middle, but an interesting comparison all the same.

Advertisements

9 Responses to “MBTI: Stannis Baratheon- ISTJ”

  1. Skinny Pete Says:

    Dad of the year

  2. Sairor Says:

    I’m not a “Stannis the Mannis” supporter like the rest of the internet, but I do think that what he did wasn’t as irrational as some people make it ought to be.

    I mean, you have to consider he lives in a universe where gods exist and humans can communicate with them to win their favor. Its not like he sacrificed his daughter just because the crazy idea occurred to him out of nowhere.

    But of course, while I wouldn’t call what he did “madness”, I do think it was a huge dick move. I know Stannis is big on “MUH DUTY” but what is the point of winning the game of thrones if he’s gonna sit on the throne as a broken man?

    Does he really think he will get over murdering his own daughter? Could such an empty shell of a man even lead their people as a King?

    Don’t think so.

    But that’s why this series is excelent. There’s literally no-one apt to lead Westeros and Winter’s coming.

  3. From being a cynical atheist due to witnessing the death of his parents and believing that all goodness and justice is made by men… to a petulant, unthinking religious zealot. Good work DnD. Good work. One of the major themes of ASOIAF (not show, books!) is that of identity. Discovering ones identity, losing ones identity , rediscovery of ones identity. We saw it with Arya, as who she was slowly fades away into someone else, desperately trying to hold on to the last thing that makes her Arya Stark. We see it with Sansa, we see it with Tyrion, we see it Dany etc.
    We also see it with Stannis. After the Blackwater, he’s filled with self doubt. He agonizes about whether to sacrifice Edric Storm. He knows its wrong, but he’s desperate. He’s desperate for anything that can get him back in the game and give him the opportunity to get what he believes is his, the Iron Throne. He doubts Melisandre actually caused Robbs death or Balon’s death. He’s doesn’t believe 100% in Melisandre but he’s cornered an isn’t sure if he has another choice.
    But then, with the help of Davos (“Lord Seaworth is a man of humble birth, but he reminded me of my duty, when all I could think of was my rights. I had the cart before the horse, Davos said. I was trying to win the throne to save the kingdom, when I should have been trying to save the kingdom to win the throne” ), he rediscovers his identity. He’s realizes he’s the King, whether he has King’s Landing or not. And as King, he has his duty. He doesn’t wait to get confirmation of Rhllors power after Joff dies. No. He goes to the Wall because he is King and its his duty to protect the realm.
    It has nothing to do with Rhllor or Melisandre. It has to do with him and his rediscovery of himself and what he lost at the Blackwater. Doing his duty. Compare it to show? DEPR. So yes. In books he is INTJ (The perceived nature of Stannis’s blind adherence to justice is what gives him the opportunity to execute his clandestine operations.). I will quote https://cantuse.wordpress.com/2014/09/30/the-king-with-two-faces/ Stannis seems to be driven by a sense of duty, of justice. Everywhere in the the books we are reminded of Stannis’s unyielding persona, his inflexibility. That he will break before he bends. That law, justice, fealty are paramount.

    This is true in some ways, and a complete falsehood in others. In truth, Stannis is much more complex. This entry in the Mannifesto makes the following assertions:

    A simplistic understanding of the concepts of duty and justice fail to encapsulate Stannis’s complexity, both personally and in the execution of his responsibilities as a king.

    Stannis holds to the belief that without sovereignty, justice and duty are impossible.

    Therefore pursuit of sovereignty takes precedence over the application of fair justice and honor.

    However, Stannis must almost always present the appearance of fair justice, honor and duty; an important element of safely held kingship.

    This dogmatic public persona has both diplomatic and military significance. PS read rest of Manifesto it is amazing https://cantuse.wordpress.com/

    • Taylor Says:

      Alright, I’ll be sure to check it out. Interesting stuff, this comment. I’ll get back to you after I read what’s in the link.

  4. Runehawk Says:

    Hey Taylor, I have the greatest respect for your MBTI typing skills but isn’t Stannis more of an ESTJ? The dynamic he has with Davos seems to reflect ESTJ-ISTJ dynamic to me?

    Cheers Bro

  5. Taylor, I hold deep respect for your typing skills but isn’t Stannis the ESTJ with poor Fi? His relationship with Davos strikes me as the ESTJ-ISTJ dynamic.

    • Taylor Says:

      Thanks for reading/commenting. But as far as Stannis goes, I see more of the sullen stoic than the commander barking orders. While it’s not as simple as “ESTJs are loud and ISTJs aren’t,” Stannis approaches everything with a more internalized demeanor. Meaning that while we have an idea of the kind of character he is based on what we see him do, he’s clearly more of a loner than a leader, like ISTJs are in comparison to ESTJ. Stannis could be seen as a malevolent Ned.

      • Sivabalan Says:

        Ah. I see where you’re coming from. I do contrast Ned and Stannis.
        I guess the trouble is THESE are fictional characters and we’re depending on GRR Martin’s writing consistency to accurately portray their characters.

        You’re right, it’s not as simple as loud/not loud, loner/leader. But those tropes exist in fiction for a reason. My own reasons for why Ned is an ISTJ is the way he is written and viewed by others.
        -Cold-eyed by everyone else but his family.
        -Not seeking power for himself
        -And even while he is warm to just his family and northern kin, he still needs lone time to sit by the weirwood.
        -He is faithful and loyal to a fault and pays for it. I believe he even understands that others don’t play by his rules. He remains faithful to Robert and never mentions how Lyanna truly felt about him or criticises him to the level of support he gives.

        Much like Davos. Davos actually respects the man who chopped his fingers off, despite absolutely needing him to smuggle food to survive that siege.

        I think Stannis imposes his values on others much more than the above two. And being a high lord in a medieval setting probably didn’t help to shape his sensitivity.

        Stannis may have an internalized demeanour but his actions are LOUD. He needs Davos for anything resembling discretion or diplomacy because he’s really bad at it. He knows his values and thoughts and that’s the LAW to him. I don’t see him in Ned’s place quietly trying to place the queen under house arrest and protecting the children.

        His blunderbuss approach to things is comedically entertaining for me in the book. He turns up where he’s not wanted, makes people wince at the thought of him and serially fucks things up for others.

        Which is why I feel ESTJ is the best fit for him, he seems to share the dom-aux of ISTJ so it’s easy to confuse him for one. But he shares the inferior function of Fi for INTJ (an unhealthy one).

        The loud leading ESTJ trope is a healthy ESTJ. Stannis is an unhealthy ESTJ with his Te dominating his personality.

        https://www.personalitypage.com/html/ESTJ_per.html
        ^not my site. Just the other one i use apart from yours to learn. Thanks dude

  6. Ah. I see where you’re coming from. I do contrast Ned and Stannis.
    I guess the trouble is THESE are fictional characters and we’re depending on GRR Martin’s writing consistency to accurately portray their characters.

    You’re right, it’s not as simple as loud/not loud, loner/leader. But those tropes exist in fiction for a reason. My own reasons for why Ned is an ISTJ is the way he is written and viewed by others.
    -Cold-eyed by everyone else but his family.
    -Not seeking power for himself
    -And even while he is warm to just his family and northern kin, he still needs lone time to sit by the weirwood.
    -He is faithful and loyal to a fault and pays for it. I believe he even understands that others don’t play by his rules. He remains faithful to Robert and never mentions how Lyanna truly felt about him or criticises him to the level of support he gives.

    Much like Davos. Davos actually respects the man who chopped his fingers off, despite absolutely needing him to smuggle food to survive that siege.

    I think Stannis imposes his values on others much more than the above two. And being a high lord in a medieval setting probably didn’t help to shape his sensitivity.

    Stannis may have an internalized demeanour but his actions are LOUD. He needs Davos for anything resembling discretion or diplomacy because he’s really bad at it. He knows his values and thoughts and that’s the LAW to him. I don’t see him in Ned’s place quietly trying to place the queen under house arrest and protecting the children.

    His blunderbuss approach to things is comedically entertaining for me in the book. He turns up where he’s not wanted, makes people wince at the thought of him and serially fucks things up for others.

    Which is why I feel ESTJ is the best fit for him, he seems to share the dom-aux of ISTJ so it’s easy to confuse him for one. But he shares the inferior function of Fi for INTJ (an unhealthy one).

    The loud leading ESTJ trope is a healthy ESTJ. Stannis is an unhealthy ESTJ with his Te dominating his personality.

    https://www.personalitypage.com/html/ESTJ_per.html
    ^not my site. Just the other one i use apart from yours to learn. Thanks dude

Discuss!

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: